Who Pays
2006-12-13 10:12 p.m.
Allow me to begin by saying that I don�t believe this thing is going to work out. BUT. I do like this girl very much. I�m sure we could stick it through as a wonderful learning experience for the both of us, but I�m positive that after enough time one of us would end up dead or in a rubber room.I like her company; I think she�s beautiful and very sexy. I enjoy our conversations and arguments. And I�m literally addicted to her full and delicious lips, to which I�ve had very restricted access. She�s smart, fun, funny, stylish, corny in the right way, and she�s a �good girl�. More on that in a bit.
Of course, getting along with me isn�t always easy, and in my world such things remain explicitly entertaining.
We just had our third date the other day. Had lunch, did some shopping (for her interview the next day), had dinner and she was off just in time for me to catch the 2nd half of the bears game.
We have a couple obvious contention points.
* She�s argumentative. Well to clarify � WE�RE argumentative. She has the exact trait that, before I�d met her, I�d thought I�d grown out of. Oh no, she brings out the Very best in me. We will endlessly argue the logic of complete nonsense to the detriment of actual conversation. I say something, she has a witty response, I reply in defense, which brings out her defenses and here we go again. And this isn�t a �couple times� after we �got to know each other�. This has been consistent until the last 3 hours of the 3rd date when I brought it up and we both agreed to consciously stop it. This is also known as The Battle of the Last Word.
* No drinking, no smoking. Not specifically (but partially) for a moral reason. She�ll have a couple beers, but 4 or 5 finishes her, so she doesn�t drink much or often. And she used to smoke when she was younger. So, when with her I tend not to drink or smoke. I don�t particularly mind for now, but who knows how long such a thing can last with a drunk like me?
* She goes home early. 10 is late for her. Meanwhile, I tend to be out til 7am regularly.
- Before I get to the next one I have a little side bar. I met this girl through a dating site, and her profile says she�s 29, which she passes for easily. She mentioned last weekend that she�s older than 29. I found out her last name yesterday � one result returned later that night on the Mandatory Serial Killer Check (aka google/yahoo/myspace/etc). High school graduation listings. She�s 34. I don�t care � age means nothing to me. But being that it was listing HS graduation years, the obvious immediate next thought is �how old was I in 1990? 7th grade.� Again � doesn�t matter, and by no means a detriment. A plus, actually, but an interesting aside.
* well� this one has so much potential, if at least for comedy. She�s a Christian girl. Which brings me to this quote immediately following one of our minor humorous tiffs in which she asked me not to blaspheme:
"Ok, Alright, look.. i'll do my very best� And this isn't easy for me!! But I will do my Very Best not to blaspheme if you promise not to preach. But as Soon as you start preaching, all kinds of blasphemous shit is going to start pouring out of my mouth . I can't help it, it�s like I have blasphemous Tourettes."
And that�s it. No such thing as a perfect match, and some of these things may become a big deal and some may be forgotten. Honestly, I can�t wait to see her again (dinner and some Mozart thing at some library this weekend). And I truly enjoy our time together.
But as a final part to this summary, I leave you with our recent phone conversation, which ended about an hour ago. It stemmed from an email conversation � and here�s a couple excerpts from that (keep in mind that she talks shit endearingly, so don�t take her comments negatively):
��Yeah no more late nights with you. I'm an old woman. Plus that way you'll have more $$ to spend on that scotch/whiskey you love so much and you won't have to worry about having to spend any $$$ on me��
��Don't want to hear that old woman BS. And don't worry about my budget. I've plenty for long days and nights with you as well as with my favorite bartenders��
��Oh, is that right? Your money is looooooooooong like that? Hmmm. Interesting. So why then have you been asking me to cover movies, and drinks and shit? OH! My bad, so you'll have more $$$ for your OTHER dates!!!Oh, I get it now ;-)��
��first. what other dates? 2nd. even if i were a millionaire of sorts, you can stand to cover a drink or movie or two��
And then I called her� not because of these comments, as I basically ignored them, but actually to hear about how her interview went yesterday� The conversation eventually led to this:
Actually, let me preface this. Her quotes here make her sound pretty bad, but she was agreeing with and appreciating my points. Most of her points were prefaced with, �well my mother would say, my father would say, the guys I�ve dated�, etc.� Essentially, she�s Never had to pay for anything in the presence of men and was surprised when she would have to pay for nominal things with me.
Along with that point, she asked me a couple times not to say �you� as she wasn�t specifically stating things on her specific behalf. And so this rant is meant to be general.
Also, this is paraphrased. Our conversation was very similar, and I was on a bit of a rant, but there�s no way I could get this word for word. Her interjections are in quotes.
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Look, I understand where you�re going with this. Especially as the beautiful woman you are, I�m positive you�ve rarely been asked to pay your way�
She went on to list male family members, male friends (including gay friends), and so on who have always paid for everything. I let it go for a couple minutes and stopped it�
I know, look, I know you�re about to list every man you ever come across in your life and tell me that they�ve paid for everything, and they were offended when you even considered helping. And that�s fine. I�d been that for a good deal of my life. And most of us are. We�re brought up that way.
And trust that I know the societal standards for these things. But here�s the deal. Every Day - we hear that �chivalry is dead�, �this is the time of the independent woman�, �there�s no such thing as a gentleman�, etc. BUT, we�re still expected to pay for dinner. We�re still expected to do all sorts of things that don�t exist in an equal world.
I don�t agree with that expectation. As a matter of fact that expectation nullifies the expected acts. What good is a free dinner if every dinner�s free? Who cares if I open your door if you�ve never opened your own? I should choose to do these things, and maybe you�ll notice and appreciate them. But the expectation has no place.
And even more so at this point. We barely know each other. We�re not even quite �friends� yet, but somehow I�m expected to pay for everything? Where else, in any place in life, is such a thing considered normal? How often do you pay for the meals of friends? Family members? Anyone? Only on their birthdays, if then. But if I�m a man and you�re a woman, every day is your birthday.
Why have a job? Why even have your own apartment? Why claim independence when you�re merely awaiting a life of dependence?
There�s something you have to understand about me. The woman I�m involved with - any woman with whom I�d want to spend more than 5 minutes of my time, is an equal to me. I don�t want her picking up after me. I don�t want her doing my laundry. I don�t want her washing my dishes. I�m not some Neanderthal. I�ve been doing all these things for myself for quite some time and will continue. If I�m a slob, I�ll hire someone to do that shit, not go find a woman.
My woman is my closest friend. My teammate. �We� against the world. The person I learn with, the person I continue to challenge and who continues to challenge me. Equals through everything. Who am I to expect her to feed and pick up after me and who is she to expect me to pay for everything?
Just as well, what sense is there for us to only go to dinner on my buck, when we could do twice as much in an evening on ours? I could pay for a nice $60 dinner, but We could enjoy a $100 evening which includes the nice dinner, some pool, a few drinks, whatever. And that goes all the way through life. If I�m making somewhere around 120k a year, I can support a family just fine and maybe go on a trip once in a while. But if our household is making about 200k a year we can live comfortably and well, and likely retire as royalty.
It doesn�t make sense in an equal world (or a world that�s headed towards equality) to rely on one person�s income. On top of that, we�re at a point where many women are making twice as much as their men, while the men are so scared of hurting their pride that they�re still paying the bulk. And if things go to shit, the woman leaves with a fat bank account and the man goes bankrupt � likely paying child support as well.
These standards stem from before women were even allowed to vote. If you still don�t think there�s a double standard, I�ll ask this: When is the last time you met a man whose company you enjoyed so much that you decided you wanted to take him out to dinner, and he also allowed you to do so?
�I can�t� wait� let me think about it�� A minute or so passes. �Never�
So you can�t tell me these things aren�t expected. And I don�t appreciate the expectation. The way it�s generally done is the man pays for the �big things� and the woman can use her cute little income from her precious little job to buy some nice clothes and other girl stuff. I imagine you take far more pride in what you do for it to be considered precious and little.
These are lingering constructs from a man-centric world and if a woman expects things to improve for women, she has to accept the responsibility for the place in the world she wishes to hold. Women claim independence but you find it odd that a man would ask her to pay a portion of a check.
�My mother would say that if I�m paying for things, then I could do these things on my own or with a friend, so why should I do them with some guy?�
That�s EXACTLY my point. Why would you? If the dinner isn�t free what the hell are you with this guy for? It�s an important question to consider. Regardless of you and I, you should ask yourself that with everyone. If what I�m getting from this person on a superficial level didn�t exist, would I still be here? If the only thing that�s keeping you around is the free dinner, please� Please. Go away.
�But a man should WANT to take me out, and since he�s taking me out, he should pay for these things.�
That is quite literally paying for your time. Such a thing is actually illegal in most states. I�m not going to pay to be with you. Most importantly, you should want to spend time with me as much as I�d like to spend time with you. It shouldn�t require payments of dinners, drinks, etc. Your presence isn�t a service and I don�t have the time or patience to go around offering free dinners to women because they�re cute.
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And that was it. She understood my point and the conversation continued elsewhere. Maybe it�ll end up a deal breaker. And if it does, so be it. As usual, I mean what I say, even though I tend to say things in an odd way.
Anyways, I suppose we�ll know for sure if she actually comes out on Sunday.